TALK 898 - New MPC Gen2 - Flat Wound

[Paulee] Sonic.

[Nick] Hello, everybody. Welcome to Sonic Talk episode eight nine eight. Recording today are at the end of the world in The UK.

[Nick] It's 36 degrees here in the in Bath where we are. I think much of Southern Europe and Northern Europe is extremely hot, which is why I'm in the top bedroom because I've got an air conditioning unit because in the office, it's very, very hot.

[Nick] As ever, I often have to say this isn't a podcast to do with weather because but it does seem to have an undue amount of influence

[Nick] on this show more than I would expect. This is Music Technology podcast. We talk about all things to do with recording,

[Nick] studio, synthesizers, drum machines, software,

[Nick] music production, all of that kind of stuff, music, live playing, everything that we can find topics for. We the last show lasts about an hour, and we will be doing just that. I'm on a process of trying to kind of get the the show a bit more visibility. We've going a little while, it sort of gets a bit comfortable, I think. So I'm hoping to encourage some of our

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[Nick] AtoVi, Fade the Punk review went up as well a couple of days ago. I went live to the to everybody and be at Gearfest this weekend. So if you're there, say hi. My daughter's got a new job, and everybody there is going to Gearfest apparently. So she's challenged them all to get a selfie with me and send them to her. So we'll see how she goes. And while I'm on the subject of my daughter, I want to give her massive congratulations. She got her exam results today from her uni course. She got a first. So woo hoo. Well done. Nice one, daughter. Excellent work. Money well spent and all of that. So anyway

[Nick] oh, yeah. I was gonna say, before we introduce our guests, I'll just give a quick plug for our Patreon. I was gonna try and do a a new ad for this, but there is more stuff that is is on this. But, anyway, this will give you idea and YouTube membership as well. Back after this.

[Nick] Yeah. I'm back in the room. So I also in an attic somewhere near me. I if I actually, if I stood on the roof, Gaz, I could probably wave, and you might just be up there. I I think you're just a bit too far away from that. Just down there in Bristol, but attic life, I can guarantee, and I know, yeah, it's grim, isn't it? It's hot. I feel for you, guys. So thank you for joining us today. No. Thank you. Yeah. It's great to be here. Thank you very much. Yeah. It is absolutely boiling, and my, yeah, my studio is,

[Gaz] yeah, as you say, in the attic. And, oh, man. And I got a load of stuff I need to be doing as well. Yikes. Pop dun pop dungeon rehearsal starts next week. Fantastic.

[Gaz] And and

[Gaz] got somewhere in the region of 40 pieces of music to learn.

[Gaz] Interesting process. This is the Charlotte Church pop dungeon, and it's a was the late night pop dungeon, but now it's the end times pop dungeon.

[Nick] And does it feel like it today?

[Nick] The fires of hell.

[Gaz] Yeah. And the way that that particular band works, it's a fantastic band. I mean, she

[Gaz] ended the band in 2023,

[Gaz] but we kinda were hoping that she'd bring it back, and, thankfully, she But the way it works is we hybridize a lot of other people's material, and we kind of, like, do kind of mashups. Mashups. Yeah. Yeah. Not just mashups. Really unexpected, like, turn like like, flipping songs on the fly from one song into another song and then be full of twists and unexpected turns.

[Gaz] From a musician point of view, it's absolutely amazing. Keeps you on your toes. It's only a small band, four piece band, bass guitar,

[Gaz] keys, and drums. I'm playing bass. But then there's Charlotte and then four

[Gaz] singers as well. So Nice. Four backing singers. So Who come who comes up with the ideas? Do you do you all chip in and go, oh, this one works, or is Charlotte's work? Or how does Well, it's that's a great question. The thing about it is the four band members are all, like, kind of band leaders in their own right. So there's too many captains,

[Gaz] really. So we do sort of like, Charlotte is the boss, and, ultimately, what she says goes. We do put a lot of ideas in, but, ultimately, she you know? And and we all have to just, like, accept that. And sometimes,

[Gaz] I thought, oh, I don't know about this. I think and then we do the gig, and it absolutely slays. So I have to kinda go, okay. You know, her decisions are good. She's much more in touch with things than I am. I mean, I'm always just trying to shoe horns or seventies prog rock kind of.

[Nick] You know?

[Gaz] So,

[Gaz] yeah, so there's probably good reason there. But I mean, but it is that sort of thing.

[Gaz] But you know what's just fantastic though is I've probably mentioned this before, but I generally although maybe not so much in recent times, but, like, I've I've always tried to see if I can make my life about playing fuzzoire

[Gaz] bass in situations. So

[Gaz] the pop dungeon is one where where I get to do that. And I get to know, I've slid across the stage on my knees, you know, I I kinda do in kicking in the air and all this kind of stuff and get to wear the most crazy outfits,

[Gaz] you know, do really ridiculous bass solos and just you know?

[Gaz] And, like so when it all came to an end, I was kinda thinking, oh, oh, no. Where else? Where else do you get the opportunity? Yeah. Like that. Yeah. So yeah. So it's really great. We got festivals and and some

[Gaz] like, quite some quite big big shows actually sort of in September.

[Gaz] Tickets have just gone on sale for it now, actually, But a few days

[Gaz] yeah. So the process starts next week where we've got the long list, and then we go in with a

[Gaz] I've kinda learned now not to I've gone in before, like, trying to having to, you know, completely

[Gaz] memorize everything

[Gaz] only for a lot of the stuff, not even to make the cut or not even get a chance to even place through some of the stuff that I've learned. So Right. So what I've done now, I've been on I've been crafty, is that I've managed to grab everything off the playlist,

[Gaz] put it into Cubase, then use some of the tools in Cubase. So I've done stem separation. So I've all got all of the parts, like, you know, bass parts, drum parts. I can kind of just decide what I want to listen to. Also, the chord extract as well. So all the tracks so I've got a big project in Cubase with all of the tracks with all of them broken into stem separation

[Gaz] and with chord tracks. Now, you know, this is kinda like utilizing some of that stuff, maybe not for what it was necessarily purposed for, but for, like, this kind of learning process. It's absolutely amazing because I can I can just solo the bass that I've extracted? I mean, it's reasonable. That's actually very good at what it does. Good enough. Yeah. Yeah. Good enough. And then I can kinda listen to it, then I can then mute the bass

[Gaz] and play Play along. Along in its place. And then I've got all the the chord track there with all the changes coming up so I can be watching it. And then

[Gaz] and then I actually What was put I put the bass line down into the bottom section of Cubase, and then I can actually see all the pitch contours of it as well, you know, in on the on the piano roll as well. So I can see what the lines

[Nick] yeah. Right. Nice.

[Nick] That sounds great, actually. I'm I'm just trying think. What's that? What was the note? Paulie also here. Paulie from Birmingham, a vintage special digital specialist with a with a rather

[Nick] a rather kind of ironic

[Nick] pink noir sign, which are quite I I

[Nick] would be hard it would be hard if it was black because you wouldn't be able to see it. There's no such well, there is there is such thing as black light, and I suppose pink is the closest thing to it because it's like UV, isn't it? But anyway, how are you, Paul? Are you well? A black light might show up things that you don't wanna see.

[Paulee] Yeah. That's true. There's always that problem. Who lived in this room before and then you shine a black light around and it's like something Anyway, terrible has yeah, I'm okay. I have been,

[Paulee] you know, as fast as I can go getting this Iridium m k two review

[Paulee] finished Yeah. It's a pretty edited. It's pretty dense, I'd imagine. I know I I know that you you've always said that you don't review

[Paulee] work stations, and it's not quite a work station because the sequencing,

[Paulee] you know, is more kind of pattern sequencing, but the amount of synth engines and stuff in it is, you know, it takes takes a long time to go through. But I've done some cool stuff with the Aphex Twin mode where you can switch switch patterns. So hopefully, that'll be done by the weekend.

[Paulee] Then I've got to get I've got to edit the next retro cast. Retro cast seems to be going pretty well. We're number one in Namibia, aren't we? Or something random like that, Andy. Send me an email.

[Paulee] Yeah. We've totally got that Namibia market

[Paulee] sorted,

[Paulee] which is absolutely amazing. But the other thing I've got to do is I've got to rehearse

[Paulee] some stuff because I've got

[Paulee] couple of opportunities on the nerdy vintage computing

[Paulee] festival circuit coming up. So there's gonna be the vintage there's gonna be kick start three in Derby,

[Paulee] and there's going to be

[Paulee] in a Liverpool

[Paulee] vintage computer festival,

[Paulee] Great Britain.

[Paulee] And I'm basically part of the after party entertainment.

[Paulee] So, you know, we bring in, you know, Commodores, Amigas,

[Paulee] BBC Micro maybe might make an appearance. Get get

[Nick] is going to work. Gas gas is fist bumping there. Yeah.

[Paulee] Sink

[Paulee] it all up, and then, you know I mean, I could walk off stage. People just come to see the old tech, basically. I could just leave it leave it running. They could stand and look at the cool old computers, but no. I'll do a I'll do a set and add some vocals on top, and that kind of thing always seems to go down really well with Yes. Drunken older gentlemen.

[Paulee] So

[Nick] that's my crowd. Well, many things do go down very well with drunken older gentlemen. I can I can I can certainly I I'm just gonna think the last experience I had of that was quite recently, actually? I think I was out on Saturday night and Friday night and didn't go out on Sunday night. So yeah. But it's been a big week. And then there was a the England last week last week was the England match, wasn't it? So I went went to that. Yes.

[Nick] Well, not I didn't go to it. I went to a friend's house and watched it. And and

[Nick] then what else? Yeah. Well, anyway, it's been clean. I I was gonna say, what was can anyone remember? Do you do you remember there was that little jambox thing? JBL, wasn't it? It was the JBL thing that that that separates the stems. You you feed them in on Bluetooth, and you can turn the bass off. Yeah. And then play along. That that sounds like something that might be useful as well. Probably a lot less of a kind of heavy lift on the back end tech than than you've given yourself, but it may be that that's helpful for to you. I understand. Be, couldn't it? Yeah. But, I mean, you know, as I say, just what was talking about earlier, though, you know, I I love it when technology is actually useful.

[Gaz] Do you know what I mean? You actually it's it's actually kind of doing something that's actually helpful,

[Gaz] which isn't always the case. So, yeah, so it's cool. But

[Gaz] something else I am really looking forward to, though, is I've got this really brilliant bass synth pedal. It's

[Gaz] Oh, why? Yeah. Yeah. You'll like this? This one.

[Paulee] Oh,

[Gaz] okay. Yep. Because it now share impact. Yeah. And it it now can it's now got an FM synth mode and can actually import d

[Gaz] x seven patches

[Paulee] into it. Bloody hell.

[Nick] So you can import d x seven. Slap bass.

[Nick] Yeah. Slap the slap the d x Could you actually plug your bass into it and start

[Nick] playing start start

[Nick] what's it? Yeah.

[Gaz] So it's actually really good. I mean, it tracks brilliantly well. So bass guitar in, and then and then you can tap out MIDI. But it's also got a really interesting thing that I've not seen before. It's out of the DIN output. It's actually got a

[Gaz] a special cable. It's a MIDI out, and it gives you two CV outs as well Oh, wow. Out the same socket, which I've not seen before. Well, not all of the not not all of the not all of the pins are used in most MIDI. There's two spares. So I I suppose Yeah. So I'm I'm assuming it's something like that. But then yeah. So you can get a CV and gate output out of the outputs as well. So bass bass guitar in, MIDI, and CV and gate out. And and it's got, like, a incredibly

[Gaz] complex

[Nick] editor for it as well on the, you know, computer editor. You can't do you can't do everything from here by a long shot. You've got, like, some top level controls. What you want is it is it to run on a BBC Micro or Commodore so you can have that to the side. That would be the real sort of super chic way of of dealing with it. Think, Gaz, if you could just somehow make that happen, that would be good. But yeah. So but, I mean, I'm gonna be putting that through its paces. Because a lot of the tunes we've gotta do, you know, they are more from a sort of programmed synthy sort of modern production sort of background that aren't necessarily It's the tracking. It's the tracking. I I remember I remember when when I was working on production rehearsal with Gold Flap, Charlie Jones, who's a really good solid bass player, he was using the I kind of want it. It was like a boss synth pedal for for bass sounds for for certain tracks that were,

[Nick] you know, that was synth bass. And it was really, really hard

[Nick] Yeah. To get it to to trigger consistently. What he ended up doing was playing up an octave because you get a faster track because the wave cycle is through the system first, and then you drop the octave down in the base pedal. But it was still very, you know, it was very meandering. He had to really concentrate. I think it was White Horse, which had a very very just of eight bass

[Gaz] part all the way through. That's super hard to do. A lot of a lot of the reason is is to get the actual transient

[Gaz] note on, note off kind of information

[Gaz] that that that's typically what the problem is. Something that this does, though, that's really good is it can interpret ghost notes as like a kind of bump. So you can kind of put your feel in so you can go bump.

[Gaz] And it what? Does a c zero or something? It it does just it it sort of just seems yeah. I'm not quite sure how it does it, but it interprets what you're doing as a not as a note, more as a sort of ghost note. So Wow. A huge part of bass guitar feel are those little kind of, like, you know, knees They're like rests, aren't they? They're like just little sort of Yeah. Yeah. It's like So Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[Gaz] No. I'll just say if any bass players out there, I would really recommend this. It's actually, funnily enough, it's based on an Akai pedal originally that was made by the same people, the same designer. It's a Hungarian champ

[Gaz] called the Deep Impact. Those that go for silly money.

[Gaz] And

[Gaz] and then this is like a kind of, like, brought bang up to date sort of future impact. Sorry. Deep Impact. This is called the Future Impact version four. Comes they've got a new

[Nick] smaller footprint available now. But, yeah, I'm sorry. I'm just going on about that. No. No. That's alright. To be fair, a cheaper card company says, does that pedal have a flip switch to swap between flat or round round round bass strings, which I I didn't know that that was a thing. Is that Is that that wouldn't be Just being funny, was that true? Think that might be being a little bit flippant. I don't think that would make a difference.

[Gaz] There is a there is a thing, though, that well, there is an interesting point there, though. With some of these things, if you roll the treble off, you know, off your instrument,

[Gaz] and then you have just, like, a more of a a less of a brighter sound, that's sometimes quite a good way if it's too jittery for sort of dumbing down the sensitivity from the bass guitar itself.

[Gaz] But by and large, I would personally prefer using round rounds because of the you get a much longer sustain of round rounds. So flat round strings tend to have a very kinda quick Does anybody I mean, just a general kind of consensus. Does anybody use flat wound? Or what are they for? Flat wound? Flat wound is super popular now these days. I mean Oh, they really? Oh, gosh. Yeah. I mean, there's like like, for instance, Wolfpack, the band, like, who really you know, the bass player Joe Dart is a real kinda superstar bass player these days, and he's very much sort of the epitome of a flat round sort of bass player. But lots of bass players, I mean and surprising bass players played with flat wound. Steve Harris and his galloping baselines in iron maiden. You know, you'd expect that to be, like, bright round rounds, but he's a flat wound player. And flat wounds are characteristic? Are they just duller? Less harmonically?

[Gaz] My my friend Billy Fuller describes them as x shaped notes. So I think that's quite a good quite a good analogy for the sort of envelope characteristic of flatwounds. So they do put if you think Paul McCartney, you know, come

[Gaz] together, that's a classic sort of flatwound bass sound. Oh, okay. You you kind of but then, oh, like like

[Gaz] but even you could, like like, slap when you slap if you think about slap bass and you think about, like, kind of Mark King or or or Marcus Miller, that really bright, clacky sort of slap bass sound, that's very much a round ground thing. But think more about that dull kind of lovely Chuck Rainey, the way he, like, slaps on the chorus of

[Gaz] Peg by Steely Dan. You know, that was much more of a flat wound kind of vibe. So flat wounds have got a softer they're much nicer on your fingers,

[Gaz] honestly. Like, when you I mean, I'm like a round round fanatic, though.

[Gaz] But when you play with when you play with flat rounds I've got a few basses for flat rounds on. The strings are just really smooth, and you just don't get your fingertips all ripped to shreds at least you do with with with round rounds. But but but as I say, there's just a lot less sustained. And, actually, if you wanna try and get a more sort of double bass kind of vibe, that flatworms tend to lend themselves more to that as well. Yeah. Thank you very much for clearing up. I'm glad I asked.

[Nick] I guess there's some topic. I mean, this is all great because, mean, it's a little quiet to be fair this week. I mean, I'm not I don't wanna I don't wanna belittle any of the news that we do have, but, you know, it's it is a bit quiet, and that's just the way it goes. I mean, that's that that happens in the summer. I mean, it's interesting now. I mean, just coming out summer, you know, it's like none of the buses are running on time. Nobody's answering any phone calls. All the schools are shut. It's just like literally the whole country's not shut down because of the heat. I I did actually discover a few things because I've been using OBS here, which for those of you don't really don't not recognize, OBS is like a free video switching and comp compensating tool. And I finally figured out because OBS is very hard or has been you can get like

[Nick] a a border around a cat a shot

[Nick] with a mask and a border. I figured out how to do that. So it means I can compose I can compose my my shots in there and just record it straight out. So anyway, that's that's that's by the by. Probably not all that interested to anybody. I just wanted to get it off my chest. Alright. Let's have a look then. So this is our first

[Nick] official topic.

[Nick] Great video. It's actually it's that whole sort of two people on the side of the wall.

[Nick] Akai

[Nick] gen two one and g 37 g two. So the g two,

[Nick] two times the power. Yeah.

[Nick] So they've re released the keys the key 37, which I think was a smash hit.

[Nick] Really, I I know I'm sort of quite tempted by one of those myself, but they've added a different paint job. But the main news is a new processor, which is they say

[Nick] over four times the processing power to the previous editions, which is monster. And I don't think they've changed the pricing a bit that much. So it's kind of one of those situations where data centers haven't actually impacted haven't actually impacted on the price of technology. Computing is actually pretty cool. I mean, these look

[Nick] these do look they do as they get more and more powerful, because I think maybe the first generation of these, the CPU was a little bit underpowered. And so, you know, just the the the response to the touch screen and stuff. And now I think they absolutely fly. I don't know if you you must be imagine if you're doing gigs and stuff, Paulie, this is the sort of thing that might be I don't know. A key a key 37. That'd be I think that'd be great. I'd like to get on a plane perhaps, but a key obviously one possibly. And and, of course, the lovely Akai

[Paulee] grayish

[Paulee] kind of color scheme it comes in is very appealing. I kinda want it just for that,

[Paulee] I think. But, yes, the

[Paulee] the power and the storage,

[Paulee] it's pretty it's pretty immense. You know?

[Paulee] I haven't looked into how quick it loads,

[Paulee] but that's some kind of that's kind of a nerdy thing I like to do with

[Paulee] big samples. Do fast, you want or do you want it sort of slow, like floppy style, like proper vintage digital? I want it far. I want it fast if it's a live if it's a live situation.

[Paulee] I want it to go

[Paulee] Yeah. Well, of course. And load load that multi sample really, really quickly.

[Paulee] And, you know, some some synths let you preload things,

[Paulee] and then

[Paulee] it takes longer to boot, but then all your samples are preloaded.

[Paulee] But I never I never know whether to choose that because if all the power goes down,

[Paulee] then you're gonna have a longer boot time on you. It's it's something you you're gonna have to decide,

[Paulee] and you're gonna have to make your bed and lie in it, you know, whatever. The last one of the last gigs I did, I actually blew up the power,

[Nick] which was interesting. The power to the stage. I must have tripped a a a circuit breaker or something. But, you know, it's okay. The the old computers were fine. But yeah. So I was terrified when you got that. I was looking into what UPS is recently because we got power cuts at the office when when all the thunder and lightning came in. We've got a NAS drive that's basically backing up everything, and I just thought, oh. Oh. Oh, god.

[Paulee] But this has new synthesis, doesn't it? I think you can get the new features on the generation one as well. I think I think it's coming in OS 3.9,

[Paulee] but instead of samples in your key groups, you can

[Paulee] without using the extra plug ins, you can choose wave use the wave tables,

[Paulee] FM Okay. Synthesis.

[Nick] Think quite basic FM synthesis. Splits and layers. Right. Well, it says this will be thirty thirty two simultaneous plug in instruments and up to and up to 16 stereo audio audio tracks in standalone. That's kind of Wow. That I don't know what the original did, but it would have been less than that, I guess. Yeah. Yeah. Four times less though? Definitely.

[Paulee] Possibly.

[Paulee] I mean,

[Paulee] CPUs are just growing exponentially.

[Paulee] I see this. Right? I see this most,

[Paulee] kind of,

[Paulee] pronounced

[Paulee] in the little NAF retro game console. Well, they're not NAF. I buy maybe every couple of years. I buy a little Android console

[Paulee] by a company like Retroid or there's there's other, you know, brands. I can't remember the other really popular brand.

[Paulee] But each year, $99,

[Paulee] it's still the same price, but they put in a CPU which will run a later generation of emulators. You know what I mean?

[Paulee] The the CPU power is is just seems to be growing exponentially.

[Paulee] I think the the RAM

[Paulee] is the It's problem. Yeah. Is the RAM and storage. Data centers.

[Paulee] Yeah. But but CPUs, they just keep on cranking them out and making them smaller and smaller microscopic

[Paulee] processes, putting more cores and more cores

[Nick] on them. I mean, Iridium got the update, didn't it? That's true. Yeah. You can get that update for your for that for that as well. It's a new board, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. An an update update board,

[Paulee] which is a really cool idea. Haven't seen that with Akai, but maybe,

[Paulee] you know, it's it's in a different price bracket, isn't it? This is like $2 in the Iridium. So to pay

[Paulee] 500 for a new board makes sense. If you're only paying 800 for the synth to begin with, you don't wanna spend No. That's another £500.

[Paulee] You might as well just sell it and buy a buy a new one. But yeah. Impressed. I think it's gonna be a really good live

[Paulee] live keyboard. And I think that's actually aren't they? Especially with the MPC sample as well. It's just really starting to kind of fly this. Both of them, one of was the first ever topic me and you talked about on the first ever Sonic Talk.

[Paulee] We we did together. You asked me about Akwae's latest keyboard. So Oh, alright. Okay. That might well be. Remy. Just gonna go in here.

[Nick] Donald Duck says he didn't buy the MPC key 37 because it was underpowered. So maybe this will be something that will Yeah. Tempt people to go. Because, I mean, the promise of having all of those keys and then not being able to play all that much. I know, Gaz, we've done a couple of things on the NPCs in the past. I mean, I know it's not your bag now, but haven't you been tempted by any of this new crop? I mean, the MPC sub, I'm still quite Yeah. If the MIDI if the MIDI was a little more

[Nick] expanded or expansion

[Nick] fulsome on the MPC sample, I would be tempted because the K o two's got fantastic MIDI, whereas the MPC sample's a bit less, but it's got really good sample handling. So these look good, don't they? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, this is all really interesting, isn't it? I mean, I remember

[Gaz] having a sneak preview at Akai over in Cambridge h at HQ there. We got through Pete years ago

[Gaz] when they were just launching the first of the standalones because, you know, it's easy to forget just there was a big period of time where the stand there there wasn't standalone MPC. So they were just No. Controllers. Controllers. So yeah. So this idea of them being standalone and now

[Gaz] maturing and getting to the point now where they can run, you know, what did you say, 32 instances of soft synths? Yeah. Yeah. You know, that's amazing. And, you know, the ecosystem's grown and grown and, you know, different

[Gaz] I can't remember where they're at now with hosting third party software within the standalone ecosystem. Is there anything there, or is it only just Well, it's

[Nick] Native Instruments

[Gaz] powered stuff, isn't it? But then and Davi owned that. So I'm guessing I I mean, I guess watch this space because they own it all. So why why wouldn't they? Oh my goodness. Yeah. Of course. Of course. Of course. So, I mean, that makes it all really something. I'll tell you the thing, though, for me. And, I mean, this is just for me.

[Gaz] I

[Gaz] kind of found when I was reviewing the NPC

[Gaz] Clive

[Gaz] the second Yeah.

[Gaz] I

[Gaz] thought, okay. It's really good. But the actual music creation process felt rooted in older practices.

[Gaz] Now

[Gaz] Right. Since my since I've moved more into sort of modular, I've you know, I'm playing around with so many interesting sort of ways of getting making music to do with Euclidean sequencing and,

[Gaz] you know, different generative stuff. I don't know. There's lots of different ways of making music now that I'm finding really inspiring. I'm still finding, like, the the the MPC way of working, although it's very effective, it's not criticism. This is just a personal thing. I was just thinking, oh, it's just the way to get stuff up and running wasn't inspiring me. Now I'm out of touch with this now, so they may well have introduced some of this stuff. One of the reasons why I bang on so much about the oxy sequence or the oxy one

[Gaz] Yeah. Is because it embraces

[Gaz] multiple different ways of the creation process. So, yeah, you can do your sort of step sequencing, your kind of your piano roll type sequencing, but then you get into the stochastic patterns or the matrices modes or the kind of the new domino modes and in a way you you've got your gates and your, you know, you've got your rhythms and your melodies as separate things. So you can have rhythms working at totally different Yes. To the way the melody work. And and that sort of stuff, I just keep it just blows my mind because it takes me into new musical territories. When I put myself into situations where I'm playing

[Gaz] on more sort of this and, again, I'm out of touch with this Yeah. Doing

[Gaz] I just kinda end up just kinda going around with the same beats and the same old thing. And I'm like, I'm sort of done with all of that. I'm just I find it. Like, for instance, a good an example now would be MyLab Melody's new

[Gaz] collaboration with the FACCO, the random eight, just as a way of working. I had a session with Steve Davis a few days ago where we had a random eight between between us, and that ran both of what our sessions were doing. And the random eight just gives you these kind of random generators. Oh, it's brilliant piece of design, but it's such a different kind of way about doing stuff. You know? And I'm curious then to see if I I do start kinda looking around at maybe some of those influences, starting some of them in. Again, I may be out of touch and maybe some Well, they got they could they could run they could probably make them in reactor modules if they like or ports Yeah. I'm sure. I'm sure. I'm sure. So so so then just to swing into the thing then, if that kind of hardware platform,

[Gaz] you know, if it's started to sort of in in going, you know, into those kind of creative generative

[Nick] areas, I think I would be more interested. That's an interesting point, isn't it? Yeah. It's so funny, isn't it, when you consider it? Because

[Nick] the the pad based layout has driven so much of a sort of the the previous wave of how we make music, you know, non keyboard based, non guitar based, you know, the the 60 or the eight by eight pads is is being a sort of over maybe the last ten years, quite a driving force or maybe even more, you know, as those pad sizes increase. And now that's can almost seen as old school. That's that's quite interesting. Hold that thought because I need to I need to just play an ad from our friends over at Cherry Audio. Back in a sec.

[Nick] Yeah. So

[Nick] Technomatic just said he managed to score tickets to the PopDungeon proper well, it's not PopDungeon anymore, is it? It's sorry. End of times? It is oh, it is PopDungeon. Yeah. It's the but it's the end it was the late night pop dungeon. It's now the end times pop dungeon. Yeah. Ah, that's right. Actually, thinking about it, I I should probably try and get some for Bristol because I've never seen you, and I really wanna see it. So It's a fantastic show. Yeah. It'd be great.

[Nick] Alright. Nice one. So let's see what's oh, this one we didn't get to last week. Let's do this one because this is sort of takes us this is, again, I suppose, in a way following on from what you were saying about alternative methods of inputting of making music and generating music and creating things. And and this most certainly is. This is the ADDAC

[Nick] one twenty, four strings Eurorack,

[Nick] which looks fantastic. Got all these really amazing concepts and ideas of,

[Nick] like, moving Ebo magnets and strummers and pluckers and and and and all kinds of really interesting. That looks like a muting sort of some sort of mute or is that an e bow that

[Nick] and it's really interesting.

[Nick] Price is start you know, individual modules are are start about a $100. It looks like a really nice made nicely

[Nick] made piece of equipment. It is, however, I would say,

[Nick] it's a $4.20 for the basic system. It goes up to $50.70 for the strings monster quadriceps.

[Nick] What I was struggling with was

[Nick] how do you change the pitch? I love all of these ideas. I love this, but where's the pitch change? Because, mean, this just sounds like someone tuning up to me. I mean, in terms of notes, I mean, sonically, it's different. I wonder obviously, you can see control some of these things. It's and and you've got individual outputs that can pan the strings.

[Nick] Lots loads of really interesting stuff. I mean, in a way, quite similar to the circle guitar, but with the circle guitar, you got a full fretboard

[Nick] that you can do what you need to do. I don't know. This was this was fascinating.

[Gaz] Do you think you were do you think a slide would work on this? As in slide guitar slide. Do you think Yeah. That's what I was thinking is the only kind of way. I mean, I was kind of a bit disappointed when I was looking at it. I thought they were gonna robotic tuners so you could kind of and then CV control robotic tuners,

[Gaz] which would be awesome because they can work really fast robotic tuners. So they would have to obviously

[Gaz] I I mean, I'm I'm not sure exactly how they work, but, you know, Gibson had them, didn't they? Sort of on, you know, sort of Yeah. Automatically tune them. And I just thought, oh, that would be really cool if you could put sequences into the tuners, and then they tune them, you know, and it would move them around. That felt the missing part to me. Although, I mean, the thing with the slides, though, is using the slide would

[Gaz] I I think is I I mean, you could do quite a lot of things, I reckon. Like, you could probably place

[Gaz] some stuff over the strings and just kind of Capo or something like that. Well, not a capo, but maybe just sort of like

[Gaz] gosh. It's it it's funny that you're saying that because I for me, I was when I first saw this, was like, yes. And then no.

[Gaz] Because of this. But, I mean, because I'm not sure there's enough string lengths to get any really meaningful slide action on there. Oh, I'd like to try it. I'd love to try it.

[Gaz] But then I guess there is this thing if you do set them up as, like, drones, sympathetic drones, and then

[Gaz] the way that you can excite the string. There's a lot of cool

[Gaz] sound design possibilities with it. But

[Nick] but the the the rigidity of pitch is, like, it's the elephant in the room. Think it's quite yeah. Four notes. It seems quite Yeah. Could put harmonic you could you could fret harmonics and stuff. And, Paulie, you you you posted this one because you said, oh, we gotta talk about this. And I I I wonder what it was that got you got you as you know, because, I mean, four notes is quite a limit limitation.

[Paulee] Well, firstly, four notes was enough for new order. Anyway,

[Paulee] the

[Paulee] it's the spinning magnets that excited me. The

[Paulee] not so much this not so much the keys for, like,

[Paulee] triggering it because that sounded

[Paulee] kind of like a just like a regular plectrum or something exciting a guitar. It was that spinning magnet and it was like, oh, that sounds really good. It's making a kind of pad kind of and it doesn't quite sound like an Ebo because it's affecting, you know, everything. Yeah.

[Paulee] That that's what excited me. But, yes, the the pitch,

[Paulee] it's

[Nick] These are fretboard, doesn't it? If you had a fretboard as well, because then you could you could interact with it. Yeah. That would make sense. Even if it's only like a short form free fretboard.

[Nick] You know? Even if was only what? A fifth or an octave or twelve twelve semitones or something, it would make sense to me. But I'm wondering if,

[Paulee] you know, like Makes a big keyed hurdy gurdy

[Paulee] kind of thing. You know what a hurdy gurdy is. Right? Yeah. Or a It's like a violin

[Paulee] yes.

[Paulee] So it's like a violet violin for people who don't know where you hold down keys

[Paulee] which brings, you know, I can't remember what they are, probably like a little piano felt or something similar into contact with the strings to make.

[Gaz] What's what's Gaz got? Gaz, are you about to do a I thought you're about to do that Tony Mitchell cover for a second. A slide. That's a that's a slide guitar, isn't it? That's a slide. Is that a what what Oh, yeah. Lap steel. That's mean and this is just like a cheap just cheap sort of cheap one that can get. And I was kinda thinking about this. I was thinking, well, I've been I've done it for years where I've rested the EBO.

[Gaz] I've got an EBO here as well. And rest the EBO on here and then use a slide and then one hand on the slide and then one hand manipulating effects and stuff. And it's really, really cool. And, I mean, you can pick these things up for around £100

[Gaz] or so. And I just don't really know what that other thing offers

[Gaz] particularly better than something

[Gaz] like this. And yeah. You know, with this and an Ebooks. Ebooks. Is the yeah. And you can get the cheap EBO's now.

[Gaz] There's a quite a few different manufacturers that make them. EBO originally, they was there was just one game in town, but there's loads, and they're super cheap. So you could have a couple of different ones on here for super you know, for cheap

[Gaz] and get the droning action.

[Nick] So I just Right. I mean, I also really I'm I'm I'm I'm with you there. Think because the amount of expression that you can add through mechanics

[Nick] is much less than you could do with actually a physical playing interacting with the strings. I wonder whether or not it's I mean, because you you if you look at the circle guitar, which is wow. I I I we when we first saw the circle guitar now, I posted a short on Instagram,

[Nick] and it got it's one and only video that's gone over a million views.

[Nick] Wow. And it's really but that is $10, you know, as it stands. So there must be somewhere in between. But the what that can do is amazing because that has different outputs for each string. It's got different sort of CV. Well, you can that that stepper motor thing does incredibly interesting things with

[Nick] with trigger

[Nick] and and triggering, but it's combined with the expression and the that you can add with the fretboard. Yeah. And it feels like that's this this has got all of those or or many of those things without any of the No. I know. Stuff. But

[Nick] I am wondering though, isn't it? Yeah. It is bonkers. And it's funny because every everybody who saw this everybody who saw the I know everybody who saw this topic was like, wow. That's incredible. And I was like,

[Gaz] it is, I suppose, but I I'm trying to think musically. Yeah. But I think What you would do? Because it's strings, because it's electromagnetics and stuff, then I think maybe they're just doing that small one just so you could fit it into, a a skiff or something like a Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe that's But because it's strings, you could put any length of strings on and then make your own, you know, like, one of those, you know, just, like, just move the

[Gaz] you know?

[Gaz] I mean, if you could if it was enough height, it could go over all your other modules. You'd have to put your fingers straight up.

[Gaz] But then at least have some sort of distance there.

[Gaz] But, you know, I think maybe it's a set of tools and the kind of just going, there you go. There's some nice

[Gaz] stuff. Now it's up to you to kinda invent. Maybe someone could sort of, like, dismantle

[Gaz] a Gibson Robotuner

[Nick] system and you know? But but but Well, I'd imagine also where this would where this would work would be would be with muting of strings and rhythms that happening at the mechanical end. So you can get some really sort of complex I kind of muted and damping and sort of polyrhythmic stuff. That might be quite interesting. I still think if you if

[Paulee] you leave the bass notes to something else, like a standard oscillator,

[Paulee] I think four strings is kind of just about enough to do something interesting.

[Paulee] You know, if you do if you're working in a kind of

[Paulee] yeah. If you're working in a kind of counterpoint type way,

[Paulee] then you are kind of

[Paulee] you you do kind of have enough with other modular voices to just add a bed of this, and maybe, like, play the tuner for, like, one

[Paulee] minor third to major third kind of vibe. But I agree it's not perfect, but I still wanna have a go on one. Yeah. No. It does look beautifully made. Does look beautifully made. You're absolutely right.

[Nick] And something that well, I'm glad it exists, and I I would like to hear some other stuff. All sounds a bit like a

[Nick] a Velvet Underground intro,

[Nick] Basically.

[Nick] Yes. Anyway, that's good. It's all good. It's nothing It is good. Fantastic set stuff. Let's see what people do. Good set of tools. Yeah. They look really good.

[Nick] Okay. What else have we got? Oh, I'm just trying to think.

[Nick] I feel like we have to talk about doctor Phil. You want to talk about Fender? Okay. Fender. I'd love to talk about Fender. Well, because we just well, I think maybe what I need to do then is probably just quickly get another ad in because I suspect this one might have a little bit of legs. So as we know, Fender have been doing

[Nick] all sorts of shenanigans. So we'll be back just after this, and we'll talk about it then. Okay. So, yeah, Fender. I did I I had to get a summary. I had to write a summary of this because I really found it very difficult to get my so for those of you who've not been maybe following the following the news, Fender, I've got a new a new

[Nick] CEO who's come in and sort of what's his name? Bud

[Nick] Bud Cole come in and sort of decided to make a bit of a shake things up a bit. And the first thing they decided to do was go after

[Nick] some copyright claims of the shape of the Stratocaster style type guitar. So what they've done is

[Nick] just written a whole load of cease and desist letters to a bunch of people, manufacturers

[Nick] and retailers.

[Nick] And this is on something that they've already been kinda knocked back. You know, the the the idea that some of these guitar shapes have all entered into public

[Nick] public domain, really. And they're, you know, they're not gonna win a copyright, but yet they're putting throwing their weight around. And, obviously,

[Nick] it's caused a bit of a problem.

[Nick] And Thomann, as of a couple of days ago,

[Nick] who are so Fender, the biggest guitar manufacturer in the world or have been, if they are not good, Tilly, the guitar and bass,

[Nick] have come up Thomann have basically come up and said, actually and they are arguably the biggest retailer in the world. If you can take all of Europe and their warehousing and whatnot, there may be some close some close calls there. But they've just gone back and go, okay. Prove it, essentially. They're saying, we don't think that your court case stands up. Because the reason that Fender did this, they had a ruling in the Dusseldorf court against a show a a no show Chinese AliExpress seller, and they reclassified

[Nick] the Stratbody as a copyrighted work of applied art that's in this in this one. And it was very shaky decision, and they've based this entire sort of strategy,

[Nick] global strategy on going after everybody else. So you're even And it just tirade. Strategy. There we go. And it seems like and and and Toman are going, hold on a minute. Toman incidentally

[Nick] were formed the same year as the Stratocaster was originally released, which I I think the irony is not lost. And they've just sort of gone, okay. Prove it. So now there's gonna have to be discovery. There's gonna have to be all of these things, and it's really I think they've called their bluff, and I because I think Fender do appear to be on quite shaky ground. And it's it it what it's done to the brand in a matter of, like, three to four weeks, it's like brand suicide that this guy has I see. Has has committed. It's ridiculous. So guitarists are now saying, I don't feel comfortable playing my Fender anymore. It makes me feel dirty. You know? I mean, I I mean, I know there's a lot of I mean, many people won't give a give a monkeys, you know, but it's a really big deal. And it's obviously if they were to turn this overturn the decision or keep the decision alive, then then it's a real you know, then basically, an entire

[Nick] area of manufacture and people who've improved upon the the design, the electrics are different, their headstock's not the same and whatever, will all be they'll go after them, and it just feels like a really bad idea. So that's my summary.

[Nick] Discuss.

[Gaz] Discuss.

[Gaz] You have to I mean, you have to look at what happened to Gibson a few years ago and and the long lasting damage that caused,

[Gaz] where Gibson's

[Gaz] CEO had made a bunch of missteps and brought out a bunch of products and then was eventually yeah. Like like the Dusk Tiger and guitars like that, which tried to feature lots of technology that no one really seemed to want. Anyway, he was ousted,

[Gaz] and then the person who replaced him thought a good PR stunt would be to take all of these unsold dusk tigers. I mean, there were some other ones in the same I can't remember the the names of them. And to lay them all out and just to crush them with, like, some sort of Oh, yes. Remember that. Driving over and and these were, like, I don't know, $2.02 and a half, three grand guitars.

[Gaz] And then, you know, just to make this statement, you know, just crush all these guitars. And, I mean, you know, that really backfired because it was such a stupid you know, the the thing that that put out was, you know, wasn't cool in any way whatsoever. You know, people are going, well, this you know, they might not be the to somebody. You know? Yeah. It was terrible.

[Gaz] And Gibson made a lot of missteps, and, you know, the brand managed to survive through the, you know,

[Gaz] the heritage

[Gaz] of it, really. So now what Fender have done and and to be honest, I'm gonna say something political here because I think it needs to be said. He's acting in a very Trumpian way. You know, that's sort of I suppose. Yeah. You know, I you you have to say it, you know, and we will let everyone make their own mind up about that. But it feels very Trumpian and very sort of and and and until that end, very, very stupid.

[Paulee] But, like, that this is

[Gaz] but, Leo, that this is has backfired massively, and and it's great that Thomann have done this. I think they've actually

[Gaz] if you read the their statement, I think it's actually really quite inspiring of Thomann doing this. Now got a little bit of experience of doing stuff at Thomann with a synth synth reactor and as a company, and all of my dealings for that company, they were just wonderful and a real joy to to have had have had anything to do with them. Now I'm not gonna Let me just press this button. I'm just because it this should load. Yeah. This should load tablet just so that the link goes in there. That's all. Sorry. I didn't mean to cut you off. Carry on. No. No. No. No. No. But I mean, just I mean, I don't wanna be like a corporate, you know, just like whatever. But, I mean, in my experience with Thomann, they really were brilliant. And it was a really great people at the place really like working for them. It seemed like they were really good company. So it feels like that this isn't just sort of posturing. It does actually feel like they are meaning you know, that there is a deeper meaning in what they're saying.

[Gaz] Now what will Fender do? Like, they have back tracked a little bit on this. I mean, going in on the art thing because they couldn't get a a there was no patent, was there? So

[Gaz] No. Trying to do it as as an art you know, using the

[Gaz] using the the the artistic thing is all really like, oh, I mean, come on. I mean, the Stratocaster

[Gaz] has evolved to change so many companies of,

[Gaz] you know, people, individuals like Eddie Van Halen or, you know, have have have, like, taken that basic thing, extrapolated on it, and and and thus it grows. And it's that's how this industry kinda works and thrives.

[Gaz] Not like this. This doesn't serve anybody other than, you know, is it trying to The CEO who's trying to increase the share price of, you know, which is what their job is presumably. I mean, if Thoman took off, what is it? It's Fender. It's not just Fender. It's the EVH range. It's it's

[Gaz] Jackson. It's Charvel, PreSonus.

[Gaz] You know? Sequoia. If if if tow if Thomann

[Gaz] if Thomann took all of those products them. Yeah. If they took them off. And Thomann being unquestionably the biggest retailer

[Gaz] in Europe,

[Gaz] if they I mean, that is gonna hurt Fender and the bottom line hugely.

[Gaz] So I really don't see anything that they can gain from this. And we'd be really interested to know I mean, I've I've got a friend who works up at Fender. I haven't actually talked to him lately, but I bet he's probably gutted us. Probably a lot of the people in Fender are probably aghast at this thinking this doesn't represent us. This isn't us. This isn't you know? So I feel sorry for them. And, I mean, I I particularly love Fender. I've I've got a really nice p base downstairs. I've got a lot of got loads of fenders. I I I love them. You know? I'm not gonna stop playing them because of this. I don't think that it would affect me in that way. No. There's there's a really interesting video by what's his name? Jethro.

[Nick] Oh, gosh. I thought I thought I I thought I wrote it down, but it seems to have gone now. Jethro.

[Nick] It's

[Nick] gone off. Sorry about that. Jethro Shull.

[Nick] So well worth checking out the way he goes through it, and it's a bit more interesting. I should also point out just as Fender already tried to lock down these shapes and and lost in 2090

[Nick] 2009, The US trademark use trademark trial and appeal board ruled the Stratocaster, Telecaster,

[Nick] and P based bodies have become generic instrument designs after decades of open use. There we go. Rick Paulie.

[Nick] I'm sorry. Sorry. Paulie, what were your thoughts? It is well You've got lot of strats, aren't you? Is it a strat though?

[Paulee] No. No. I am I I play tellies and a squares. A telly. I've I do. Which is which is, yeah. And it's absolutely beautiful, and I love it to bits. This is kind of

[Paulee] what what interested me is that I've done a lot of reading over the years on the history of this company.

[Paulee] And of course, Leo Fender and his original frying pan, a bit of wood design and stuff like that. And the interesting thing to me was that it just seems

[Paulee] absolutely

[Paulee] hopeless that they think they have a chance of winning.

[Paulee] It feels like the the the horse bolted

[Paulee] seventy years ago, and now you're gonna shut the stable door, you know.

[Paulee] It it does feel like a ever ever since

[Paulee] I've been alive,

[Paulee] there have been strap copies,

[Paulee] you know. Originally with the Tokai

[Paulee] springy sound and breezy sound

[Paulee] And then then when I was learning

[Paulee] in about '96,

[Paulee] Squire was huge,

[Paulee] you know, I know the other brands, other low end brands like Encore, Chart, Harley Benton,

[Paulee] stuff like that, for the beginners market. Vintage, there was a a UK bank called Vintage, which I think they're still going. They do quite nice

[Paulee] cheaper

[Paulee] copies of these guitars.

[Paulee] So

[Paulee] so for me, yeah, it's always just been a kind of generic

[Paulee] classic

[Paulee] that people riff on. Sorry for the pun. Kind of like, I guess,

[Paulee] people riff on the the shape of a car, don't they? There's only so many ways you can make a car body

[Paulee] in terms of aerodynamics and stuff like that. So it felt like It it it became so ubiquitous.

[Paulee] It just became a part of guitar language, the double cutaway, you know, the,

[Paulee] the tone selector,

[Paulee] the tremolo arm,

[Paulee] all became part of the vernacular of building guitars.

[Paulee] So that's that's what interested me about it. You know, I'm not gonna stop enjoying

[Paulee] my lovely surf green Esquire because I bought it before this happened.

[Paulee] But I I I don't know if I'd buy

[Paulee] from the com from the company either Fender or Esquire

[Paulee] again.

[Nick] You know, because of this. So maybe a new CEO could could I know. It feels like it it feels like that, you know, this is one thing that sorry. It was Rachel. I beg your pardon. I I knew I had I had some of the words and syllables right.

[Paulee] In his

[Paulee] in in the statement,

[Paulee] there was a little bit of backpedaling saying, we're not gonna sue anyone.

[Paulee] But the initial letter, the initial threat was you must

[Paulee] you must Destroy. Destroy all of your guitars

[Paulee] or we're gonna or we're gonna come after you. It's very

[Paulee] oh, it's very harsh, isn't it? It's very, very hardcore.

[Paulee] So I don't think it is possible to backtrack from that very decisive

[Nick] declaration of It feel it feels like I mean, this is one thing that Rat Ratshall was saying. He said the only real clear answer I know this is all a bit inside business, but it's sort of quite Fender are a big company with a lot of brands, and it's it's such a devastating PR blow to them. The only way they could recover from this, I think, really is, you know,

[Nick] Bud Cole has to probably be fired and then Fender have to go on the charm offensive and do a tour of of of all the retailers go, yeah, sorry about that. That that was a that was a big mistake. Forget about it. We're and and they could probably get the situation back, but it just seems such a own goal. It's I'm wondering how many orphanages they have to give guitars to in order to reclaim face.

[Gaz] You know, what's what's kinda crazy as well though is, like, you know, this AliExpress

[Gaz] kind of cheap strap that that's at the center of this. It's Yeah. You know, people, they get into the platform, and then they aspire to have an actual fender.

[Gaz] You know? Yes. It just sort of seems counterproductive, doesn't it? You know? You the the brand is solid. It's it's such a kind, iconic brand. People aspire to have I always wanted Fender. You know? It's it's that thing, and they've got that. So they you know, that's what seems all the kinda the the crazy thing about this. And the other thing as well is that Fender really, in recent years, have been making some brilliant products as well. They're you know, they've you know, over

[Gaz] the years, there's been different dips and stuff, and they've been they've been absolutely killing it lately with some brilliant instruments, great big multi effects, and, you know, some

[Nick] really high quality good stuff as well. Well, I I wonder maybe it's only assumption can be that, you know, maybe the margins are just so tight that companies feel they have to take

[Nick] drastic action like this. It may well have seemed like a good idea at the time, but obviously,

[Nick] this person doesn't understand the industry. I mean, we've seen it happen before without

[Gaz] going over old history. But, yeah, I mean, it's just you've got to be careful. You've got to be careful. It seems like they've gone for the wrong, like, the wrong enemy. You know? Mean, what's been happening in China in recent years is that these smaller

[Gaz] companies, certainly in the effects area, you know, have been making you know, from making clones and making sort of second rate stuff to actually now making some proper

[Gaz] market leading,

[Gaz] you know, in in in technology sort of terms.

[Gaz] So

[Gaz] so you're right. I mean, if their margins are kinda getting cut, but they've gone at it in the complete wrong area, haven't they? I mean, like, Europe surely is one of Fender's most important markets.

[Gaz] You would think. Yes. You you yeah. So it just seems really strange. I would I would be interested and maybe put this out there, Nick, for someone from Fender to reach out and to try and clarify some of this because

[Gaz] right now, it seems, as you said, like some sort of corporate suicide sort of mission.

[Gaz] And for such a valuable brand, and especially now they've got Prestonus and, you know,

[Gaz] that means they've got Studio One,

[Gaz] which is beloved by many of us.

[Gaz] You know, we don't wanna see this company go down. No. We wanna see this company thrive and do really well. I mean, absolutely. I I

[Gaz] love Fender.

[Nick] That's what we all want. Okay. Well, look. I mean, don't have to leave it in too darker too too darker space

[Nick] before we we wrap things up, but that is kinda getting towards the end of the show. But, yes, if there is anybody out there from Fender who would like to get in touch, I'm gonna probably put an article together because I haven't covered this at all yet. So probably put that up and maybe ask. We don't necessarily have any reach, and I'd imagine there's probably quite a lot of disconnect between top level boardroom strategy and, you know, product manager level kind of involvement. I would imagine that's getting tricky. But thank you, everybody, for joining us. Lovely to see everybody in the chat room. I can see many people there probably

[Nick] enjoying air conditioning in wherever they are right now in the countries where it's become the norm. Most of our neighbors are actually discussing getting air conditioning now because me well, our next door immediate next door neighbors, they got their whole house done, which is kind of quite unusual for these little terraced houses. And now everybody's going, oh, how much did that cost? Could we get some? And we got we got a little one. But anyway, thank you so much. Yeah. So thanks to everybody in the chat. Lovely to see you all. A big a big pleasure. Oh, that sounds like somebody's doorbell's going, guys. Have you got a delivery? Or was that It's an ice cream van. Oh, an ice cream van. Outside my house. Wow.

[Nick] Oh, Gaz, you could you you can go now. If you wanna go and catch it,

[Nick] you could get the ice cream van. You've muted yourself, but apart from that. No. I think that was outside poorly. It's not outside mine. It was outside yours.

[Nick] The burning burning I mean, I imagine. I mean, it's gonna be like the child catcher from Chit Chitky Bang Bang, the the ice cream van on a day like this, isn't it?

[Nick] Oh goodness. I don't Don't let the kids go out. I'm not. I'm not. Won't.

[Nick] Well, Paulie, I hope I hope things cool down for you and Yes. You can find the right combination of equipment to switch on that doesn't generate too much heat. Yeah. I I have a stone kitchen floor,

[Paulee] and it's the best decision I ever made in my life. Because if I just go and lie on that for five minutes, it's the coolest thing

[Paulee] Oh, good idea. So that's so that's really, really good. But, yes, I you know, despite the heat and my hair and makeup all melting off, it's been a very fun one today.

[Paulee] So, yeah, thanks for having me on, and look out for my Iridium m k two review in the next, you know, few days to next week.

[Nick] Okay. Smashing.

[Nick] Alright. Well, guys, I don't suppose you're gonna be live streaming tonight. I mean, I wouldn't if I was you, but oh, what's that there? So far Can

[Gaz] you see what's there? What's there? Can you see what that is? Oh, you've got the drop farm? Yeah.

[Gaz] And my goodness. What a fun piece of equipment that is. Again, I know a lot of people just yawn at sort of Eurorack, but

[Gaz] there's such an interesting work for I'd really recommend people have a little look at the drum farm because

[Gaz] Yeah. I think that's it looks fantastic. Yeah. It's really good fun. I mean, Jason, you know, Jason Mayo from Nobula who make it, you know, was saying that really he envisaged

[Gaz] envisions envisions people using it as a way of making drum libraries to use elsewhere, which is kind of an interesting idea making a module

[Gaz] for making samples for you know, to use on on your MPCs or other things. But, actually, there when you do get get into that particular kind of workflow,

[Gaz] it's really good fun. But, also, I mean, I took it to this jam I did with Steve a a few days ago, and it's turning it into sort of drone synths and all sorts of stuff. The kind of architecture is so interesting.

[Gaz] It's a I I won't go into it now. You can look into it, the drum farm. And it's a good name, the drum farm, isn't it? That you kind of make Yes. Make drums, you know, milk it milk it for your drum.

[Gaz] But

[Gaz] but

[Gaz] there's so many good ideas. It's really is a completely unique thing. And they you know, I mean, yes, you could do it in software to some degree, but it's the very physical nature of it. And the way that you just generate things, send them over, sample them back and forth, this it's a it's a it's a joyous,

[Nick] creative kind of space. And Nice. And and it sounds good. And that's really important, obviously, at the bottom at the end of the day. It sounds really, really good. And I've had some stuff out of it, which just is like all this. I haven't got any kind of precedent for it. They they it was kind of really Nice. Well, have you continued to have much, much fun with it? Sounds like a great Yeah. Yeah. I was I was gonna try and get one in as well. It sounds really good. Right. Well, that's it for this week. I'm gonna let you all go off and run your wrist. Top tip, if you run your wrist under a cold tap, that cools you down. It's a very Oh, thank you, Nick. Works very well because the blood runs very close to your

[Nick] to your

[Nick] to the skin. You run it and so you cross your arms. You put it under the cold tap for about five minutes, and you could feel the blood going around your body and cooling yourself down. It's a very

[Nick] good way to do things. Anyway right now. That that's it. Sonic talk.

[Nick] 898. Gosh. It's not far too away from 900.

[Nick] So And then we'll be on to 909. Oh, excellent. There's loads of 900 nature we could do. Anyway, thank you very much. It's been an absolute pleasure, everybody. We will see you all

[Nick] next time. Take care, everybody. Bye bye now. Bye.